Delay cylinder

[Don W.]

Since my rebuild is on temp hold due to funding issues I thought I throw another question out there.

Has anyone ever rigged up a throttle delay cylinder? I'm not talking "2 step" here but an actual delay cyl on the throttle linkage. I wasn't terribly happy with the way my 2 step worked last year so was thinking one of these would be a better solution.

I'm thinking 2 line locks, front & rear with a delay cyl would eliminate the mixture issues of the 2 step and give me more consistent launches and RT's.

Whaddya think?

 

[turbodig]

Re: Delay cylinder

Since my rebuild is on temp hold due to funding issues I thought I throw another question out there.

Has anyone ever rigged up a throttle delay cylinder? I'm not talking "2 step" here but an actual delay cyl on the throttle linkage. I wasn't terribly happy with the way my 2 step worked last year so was thinking one of these would be a better solution.

I'm thinking 2 line locks, front & rear with a delay cyl would eliminate the mixture issues of the 2 step and give me more consistent launches and RT's.

Whaddya think?

The thing about using a stop to launch, is that it would change from day to day. (and maybe during the day as well)

You might look into the AMS-500 boost controller. With a low pressure, dual-port wastegate, you can set these up to hold launch boost to a given level, then trip to your max level on button release.

I have the dual line-lock setup. I like it. I think it'd work tons better with a hydroboost, though, vs. my 100% stock system.

 

[Don W.]

Re: Delay cylinder

The thing about using a stop to launch, is that it would change from day to day. (and maybe during the day as well)

You might look into the AMS-500 boost controller. With a low pressure, dual-port wastegate, you can set these up to hold launch boost to a given level, then trip to your max level on button release.

I have the dual line-lock setup. I like it. I think it'd work tons better with a hydroboost, though, vs. my 100% stock system.

Just got around to looking at this controller. Very interesting. I don't see the need for a dual-port wastgate (whick I've never seen) though. Their PDF shows a standard wastgate if I'm not mistaken. Anyway at $400.00 it's a chunk of change but a very cool unit.

Thanks!

 

[ghettosled]

Re: Delay cylinder

an external wastegate would definitely be key for controlling a launch boost. The AEM controller also works well and has a high/low setting and a scramble boost feature that triggers a pre set boost when the orange wire is grounded. At $295 this is one of my preferred cost effective electronic boost controllers. Mounts nicely in a gauge pod and also serves as a boost gauge.

http://www.theboostdepot.com/index....facturer_id=0&option=com_virtuemart&Itemid=26

 

[turbodig]

Re: Delay cylinder

Just got around to looking at this controller. Very interesting. I don't see the need for a dual-port wastgate (whick I've never seen) though. Their PDF shows a standard wastgate if I'm not mistaken. Anyway at $400.00 it's a chunk of change but a very cool unit.

Thanks!

The external gate is almost a must for the type of control that this is aimed at. The dual-port is necessary so that you can have a sufficiently low launch boost, yet get enough max boost without popping the WG open against the spring.

Not that it couldn't be done with an internal, but it'd be a lot more work, and you probably wouldn't get the precision you need for bracket racing.

The beauty of this controller is that it can run 2 solenoids...one to up the boost, and one to reduce. And, they operate independently.

 

[JSM]

Re: Delay cylinder

What didn't you like about the 2 step?

I have a 2 step and a 4 wheel line lock. The combination by far has made launching easier than anything. With just the line locks it was still difficult to do.

It doesn't truly control boost at launch (somewhat due to rpm). But it is really close and has allowed me to launch withing ..08 second on my 60fts at couple different tracks.

 

[Don W.]

Re: Delay cylinder

Well the 2 step really helped with the RT, happy with that part. With just the Ultimate chip it would go way lean when on the 2 step causing lots of knock. I will be the first to admit that maybe it wasn't the 2-step's fault. Coulda been any number of other things. I was just trying to think of other ways to have a consistent launch without the 2-step's rough running when on the limiter.

BTW I'm planing on the 4 wheel line lock also.

 

[turbodig]

Re: Delay cylinder

Well the 2 step really helped with the RT, happy with that part. With just the Ultimate chip it would go way lean when on the 2 step causing lots of knock. I will be the first to admit that maybe it wasn't the 2-step's fault. Coulda been any number of other things. I was just trying to think of other ways to have a consistent launch without the 2-step's rough running when on the limiter.

BTW I'm planing on the 4 wheel line lock also.

Ultimates are lean at that area to help with spool. No surprise.

Personally, I think the 2-step and the line locks and the 2-stage controller would be tough to beat at the track. A bit of creative tuning to correct for different air temps would make things waaay more consistent.

 

[Don W.]

Re: Delay cylinder

You guys sure know how to spend my money...:rotf::rotf::rotf: Ain't none of this cast in stone, just trying to gather info as I build my motor and try to make it into a consistent racer.

Thanks!

 

[JSM]

Re: Delay cylinder

So you do a custom bin tune and get rid of the lean area on fuel map.

I would fix the real issue, vs cover it up with something else.

 

[Windedv6]

Re: Delay cylinder

Well the 2 step really helped with the RT, happy with that part. With just the Ultimate chip it would go way lean when on the 2 step causing lots of knock. I will be the first to admit that maybe it wasn't the 2-step's fault. Coulda been any number of other things. I was just trying to think of other ways to have a consistent launch without the 2-step's rough running when on the limiter.

BTW I'm planing on the 4 wheel line lock also.

It is not as easy as just tuning out the lean section in the table as it would effect drivability when not using the 2-step. The lean spike is caused by extra loading of fuel as the 2-step skips cylinders from firing. This fuel load gives the computer a "rich" look then pulls out max fuel just in time for the lanuch and you go big time "lean" before the computer reacts. In the FAST and BS3 it is overcome by setting the computer "correction limits" to only take out a bare mimumin amount of fuel in the two-step rev area even if it wants to take out more. Some run there systems in open loop while racing except for the high boost/high rpm part of the table. This will also bypass the 2-step area from being under/over fueled by the computer as the 2-step area is strictly run off of the tables. I am not certain if changing the correction limits in some of the bins can achieved the same results or not. I do believe Code 59 can do these types of programing.

John

 

[Don W.]

Re: Delay cylinder

It is not as easy as just tuning out the lean section in the table as it would effect drivability when not using the 2-step. The lean spike is caused by extra loading of fuel as the 2-step skips cylinders from firing. This fuel load gives the computer a "rich" look then pulls out max fuel just in time for the launch and you go big time "lean" before the computer reacts. John

This is what I thought was going on, you just described it way better than I could.