Electrical issues???

[crariley]

Today on my way into work my Ty had a significant miss while driving down the road. When I come up to a stop light it missed again and then died. I was able to get it started but had the same issue again when I decided to turn around and get it back home. After several more stalls and eventually getting it started again I got it back home and in the garage. Since I needed to get to work I didn't have time to do any troubleshooting but wanted to get some peoples opinion where I should start looking.

The way the truck would just immediately die is leading me to think it is an electrical/spark issue and I'm thinking the coil could be going bad. It is an MSD I replaced the OEM with about a 1 1/2 ago. I've read on here that the MSD coils have issues after I did the replacement, lol. The other issue that crossed my mind is that it's something in the ECM. But I wanted to get some feedback to see if anyone has had experience with this type of issue and if I'm going in the right direction. Also if there are some tests I can perform to isolate the issue. I'll be able to investigate more when I get home tonight.

 

[atkonkler]

Re: Electrical issues???

Was the stock coil bad? If not put stock coil back in the truck....I've warranted alot of msd coils out. That's where I would start....:tup:

 

[crariley]

Re: Electrical issues???

Was the stock coil bad? If not put stock coil back in the truck....I've warranted alot of msd coils out. That's where I would start....:tup:

I still have the OEM coil and plan on putting it back in. It was working fine when i replaced it but went ahead and replaced it while I was doing a tune up shortly after a bought the Ty.

 

[SY2932]

Re: Electrical issues???

This is how to test an ignition coil:

"This is a brand new MSD coil #8226. The coil does NOT have to be removed from the vehicle to perform these checks. Any connections on the terminals will have to be done with a paperclip or other small object as the test leads won't be able to reach the pins inside. This value should be infinite resistance (open). If not, replace the coil."

"From here on out, the resistive values are not "carved in stone" and are approximate. Here, the value should be very low or zero. If not, replace the coil."

"Here, the resistance should be high but, not infinity (open). If not, replace the coil. *These checks will work on a stock coil as well*."

I tried using the MSD coil above and ended up getting a stock one from the "stealership" after I started having misfire issues several months later. I performed these tests before I installed it on my truck. If the coil tests out ok, the next thing to check is fuel pressure. HTH's

 

[QWERTYphoon]

Re: Electrical issues???

Sounds like the fuel pump to me.

 

[crariley]

Re: Electrical issues???

This is how to test an ignition coil:

"This is a brand new MSD coil #8226. The coil does NOT have to be removed from the vehicle to perform these checks. Any connections on the terminals will have to be done with a paperclip or other small object as the test leads won't be able to reach the pins inside. This value should be infinite resistance (open). If not, replace the coil."

"From here on out, the resistive values are not "carved in stone" and are approximate. Here, the value should be very low or zero. If not, replace the coil."

"Here, the resistance should be high but, not infinity (open). If not, replace the coil. *These checks will work on a stock coil as well*."

I tried using the MSD coil above and ended up getting a stock one from the "stealership" after I started having misfire issues several months later. I performed these tests before I installed it on my truck. If the coil tests out ok, the next thing to check is fuel pressure. HTH's

Thanks Mike! I appreciate the help and will test this out tonight. Considering the issue is intermittent it might test just fine but this is still very good information.

 

[crariley]

Re: Electrical issues???

Sounds like the fuel pump to me.

The though crossed my mind but I would think if it was a fuel pump issue it would sputter before it dies not just shut off so abruptly. Regardless I will also be checking for fuel pressure as well this evening. Thanks for the input.

 

[Don W.]

Re: Electrical issues???

Intermittent issues like this can be difficult. Based on what you're saying it sound like ign to me. On the other hand a sudden failure of the fuel pump could act very much like you describe. The fact that you can get it to restart is curious. When you turn the key on do you hear the pump run for 2 secs? Cycle back and forth, waiting a few seconds in-between, and see if it runs every time. You can also pull the coil wire out of the dist. put a plug in it, ground the plug on some nearby metal and have some one crank it watching for spark. Do this especially if it's in no-start mode so-to-speak.

Testing the coil as described and even just swapping in another to see what happens is a simple place to start also.

HTH

 

[crariley]

Re: Electrical issues???

The MSD coil tested out good and fuel pressure was good but I kind of expected it since its an intermittent issue. Took the truck for a drive and about 2 minutes in it dies again. I get it started up and safely back home. I bought an Accel coil and replaced the MSD. Test drive was good for the 5ish miles I drove it. I will go for a longer drive this weekend to see if the problem is actually gone or rears its ugly head.

 

[crariley]

Re: Electrical issues???

Took a chance a drove the Ty today. The ride into work was nice and smooth but when I went to lunch I wasn't so lucky. It really sucks to push a vehicle in dress shoes with a bum foot to boot. What was I thinking???? Got her started back up and back to my office and of course it ran great. I see this issue is going to drive me crazy and will probably replace a lot of serviceable parts trying to fix it. Of course it will be the very last thing I replace that will be the resolution. FML.

 

[gstacky]

Re: Electrical issues???

Just for shits and giggles pull the distributor cap and rotor off, and look down into the distributor and see if it looks rusty in there. I had mine do some odd things last spring, and it ended up being the distributor itself, threw in another one and the problem was gone.

 

[QWERTYphoon]

Re: Electrical issues???

Almost sounds like vapor lock but I never heard that happening with our trucks. I had a similar issue and it was my memcal went bad.

 

[crariley]

Re: Electrical issues???

Almost sounds like vapor lock but I never heard that happening with our trucks. I had a similar issue and it was my memcal went bad.

How did you determine that your memcal went bad?

 

[crariley]

Re: Electrical issues???

Pretty sure I figured out my problem. The center core button on the distriutor cap that contacts the rotor button was wore down to it was flush with the surrounding plastic of the cap. Considering I haven't owned a vehicle with a distributor cap since the late 90s, I totally forgot that button is spring loaded and should extend out like an erect nipple so it maintains contact with the rotor button. I still had the stock AC Delco on hand and compared the two and saw the problem immediately. I put the AC Delco cap on and the truck ran fine with no issues. The most surprising thing is that the faulty cap is an Accel cap with brass terminals that had 12k miles on it. I would expect to see some wear but not all the way down to just a nub too short to maintain contact. Am I wrong thinking I should've gotten more than 12k miles out of the cap?

 

[crariley]

Re: Electrical issues???

After replacing the cap and driving the Typhoon for the weekend and then to work one day I thought the issue was resolved. But I was wrong!! The issue was still intermittent but getting more frequent and harder to get started when it did die. But still never had an opportunity to do any troubleshooting in the garage because it would usually run fine until I would take it for a drive. Did more research and went into part replacement mode. I bought a new ignition control module with no luck and then a new Napa distributor. While setting the timing on the truck it wouldn’t start and I figured it was because the timing was too far off. Kept adjusting the timing and the truck started!! Woohoo! Got the timing set, turned the truck off and tightened down the distributor bolt. Tried to start it and verify timing was still good and it wouldn’t start. While setting the timing I noticed the truck finally had a CEL, so I figured I would get that and see if it would offer any help. Looped the pins on the OBDI and not getting the 12 code at all. Wasn’t getting anything. So finally my first real clue pointing to the ECM as the issue. So I bought a NOID light kit to test the fuel injectors were getting voltage from the ECM. After getting the kit the truck is running great!!! Damn it!! At this point the only thing I hadn’t bought was an ECM so I called Tom at SportMachines, had a brief discussion about my issue and pulled the trigger on an ECM he had in stock. I get the ECM and just for the hell of it tried to start the Typhoon before I swap the ECM. IT WON’T START!!! This is weird to say but I couldn’t be happier it’s not starting. So I plug the NOID light into the piston 1 wiring harness and crank it. The light blinked a few times, the truck sputtered then the light went away and it won’t start. A small prize but VINDICATION that the issue was finally isolated to the ECM not sending voltage to the fuel injectors. Swapped out the ECM and she fired right up. Triple checked timing and buttoned her up. She’s been running great ever since for the past few weeks.