AV gas pros and cons
- Thread starter IGottaSy
- Start date
liquidswords88
I pity da fool
Re: AV gas pros and cons
I would never run leaded gas with an o2 sensor. If you have ever seen what a o2 sensor looks like after being hit with exhaust from leaded gas you would not either. It makes the o2 sensor very slow to respond if at all. You can take it out and get the tip red hot with a torch to burn off the build up. Leaded gas also will turn into brown mud like substance when it sits for too long. I've seen snow cross sleds that sat all summer and the float bowls looked like somebody took a crap in them. You can purchase non leaded race fuel in a variety of octane levels. VP makes a few different brews. You can test a o2 sensor by using a good multi meter and watching how quickly the resistance changes when it is hit with heat.
I would never run leaded gas with an o2 sensor. If you have ever seen what a o2 sensor looks like after being hit with exhaust from leaded gas you would not either. It makes the o2 sensor very slow to respond if at all. You can take it out and get the tip red hot with a torch to burn off the build up. Leaded gas also will turn into brown mud like substance when it sits for too long. I've seen snow cross sleds that sat all summer and the float bowls looked like somebody took a crap in them. You can purchase non leaded race fuel in a variety of octane levels. VP makes a few different brews. You can test a o2 sensor by using a good multi meter and watching how quickly the resistance changes when it is hit with heat.
IGottaSy
Active member
Re: AV gas pros and cons
Thank you.
I supposed this is better suited for older vehicles designed to burn leaded fuels.
Thank you.
I supposed this is better suited for older vehicles designed to burn leaded fuels.
It's just a six
Super Member
Re: AV gas pros and cons
100 LL gas is not a performance gas by any means.
It is used mostly on low performance air cooled airplanes. Low RPM, high altitude, type of engines use this fuel.
I used it in my 8.75:1 350 SBC & it slowed down my 65 SS Malibu by a good amount. Got it free, so I just put it in my car.. That car ran better on 87 octane fuel.
I was told it has about 10 times the lead content of any automobile gas we ever used here.
It is a great degreaser,, it just has lead in it so you should not get it on your skin. Turns your skin white because it takes all the oil out of your skin.
Old mechanics used to clean parts & everything else with there bare hands.
100 LL gas is not a performance gas by any means.
It is used mostly on low performance air cooled airplanes. Low RPM, high altitude, type of engines use this fuel.
I used it in my 8.75:1 350 SBC & it slowed down my 65 SS Malibu by a good amount. Got it free, so I just put it in my car.. That car ran better on 87 octane fuel.
I was told it has about 10 times the lead content of any automobile gas we ever used here.
It is a great degreaser,, it just has lead in it so you should not get it on your skin. Turns your skin white because it takes all the oil out of your skin.
Old mechanics used to clean parts & everything else with there bare hands.
Syclone #1188
New member
Re: AV gas pros and cons
I second this, it doesn't go bad like pump gas. Ive had a bike sit for two years and it fired right off.
I second this, it doesn't go bad like pump gas. Ive had a bike sit for two years and it fired right off.
Don W.
Stab it and steer it
Re: AV gas pros and cons
90/87 is red, 100LL is blue. So buying red avagas is going the wrong direction.
There is a back story here. Some years ago (1990s) Calif went to two colors of diesel. Red was "off road" and blond (or whatever) was on-road. The difference being the amount of taxes applied. Red diesel is not just a little red, it's a lot red. Picture this. Tanker picks up and delivers a load of red diesel. Next he goes an gets a load of jet fuel which is clear. Because of the small amount of red diesel left behind he now has colored jet fuel. Very close to 80/87. It is now contaminated and unusable. Pretty well straightened out now as trucks are and have been for years, flushed before loading avgas or jet fuel. (One of the reasons av fuel is expensive.) A quick search shows that an outfit named "Innospec" is the only company making TEL with the probable, illegal, exception of somewhere in China.
In another life I ran a fuel company at the local airport. Kinda fun actually.
Fun to think about but I would not run avgas in a car. Avgas has a lower vapor pressure so doesn't atomize/vaporize as well which probably doesn't help it work in a car although obviously it's done.
90/87 is red, 100LL is blue. So buying red avagas is going the wrong direction.
There is a back story here. Some years ago (1990s) Calif went to two colors of diesel. Red was "off road" and blond (or whatever) was on-road. The difference being the amount of taxes applied. Red diesel is not just a little red, it's a lot red. Picture this. Tanker picks up and delivers a load of red diesel. Next he goes an gets a load of jet fuel which is clear. Because of the small amount of red diesel left behind he now has colored jet fuel. Very close to 80/87. It is now contaminated and unusable. Pretty well straightened out now as trucks are and have been for years, flushed before loading avgas or jet fuel. (One of the reasons av fuel is expensive.) A quick search shows that an outfit named "Innospec" is the only company making TEL with the probable, illegal, exception of somewhere in China.
In another life I ran a fuel company at the local airport. Kinda fun actually.
Fun to think about but I would not run avgas in a car. Avgas has a lower vapor pressure so doesn't atomize/vaporize as well which probably doesn't help it work in a car although obviously it's done.
liquidswords88
I pity da fool
Re: AV gas pros and cons
Never had any experience with av gas. Always used torco race fuel. It is 110 octane and most definetly leaded. Anybody and I mean anybody who says it is ok to run leaded fuel in a o2 equipped engine is wrong. It will destroy your o2 sensor. Not sure the lead content difference between av gas and 110 race fuel but I bet it would be significant.
Never had any experience with av gas. Always used torco race fuel. It is 110 octane and most definetly leaded. Anybody and I mean anybody who says it is ok to run leaded fuel in a o2 equipped engine is wrong. It will destroy your o2 sensor. Not sure the lead content difference between av gas and 110 race fuel but I bet it would be significant.
NOJIMMY
New member
Re: AV gas pros and cons
....WOW, I'm smiling from ear-2-ear right now cause this thread takes me w-a-y back.
Remember when High Compression (Corvette) guys with 454's/427's used to swear by AV Fuel to get octane + lead in their tanks.
Toulene or Xylene would raise 2-3 points (from 92 to 92.3).
MTBE is oxygenated (lower BTU but makes gas burn better).
Methanol (wood alcohol) or Ethanol (grain alcohol) is found in Gasohol but is mildly corrosive.
And besides the octane boost ingredients above, mineral spirits (for cleaning)
and transmission fluid (for lubricating) were added.
AHHHHHH, the cycle of LIFE!
-Larry
....WOW, I'm smiling from ear-2-ear right now cause this thread takes me w-a-y back.
Remember when High Compression (Corvette) guys with 454's/427's used to swear by AV Fuel to get octane + lead in their tanks.
- In the 60's we used to run Sunoco 260 (pump gas) for high octane use
and valve seal lubrication in high compression muscle car engines. - In the 70's folks used AV Gas when the lead was removed and cat's were installed with SMOG pumps. Gas prices also jumped dramatically.
- In the 80's Sunoco sold a) standard (purple, 115 octane) b) GT Unleaded (105 octane),
c) Supreme (blue, 116 octane), and a d) Maximal (red, 118 octane) at popular gas stations for those in the know. Dunno if they still do or don't. - In the 90's everyone tried mixing their own octane boosters with a) Toulene, or b) Xylene or c) MTBE, or d) Methanol or Ethanol, or if really desperate e) Isopropyl alchohol.
- Years later folks (even today) convert to E85 for street "racing fuel".
- And Now that lower compression street engines exist everywhere with turbo's/superchargers/nitrous, water or Methanol injection is again popular (though Methanol supposedly attacks zinc and magnesium products).
Toulene or Xylene would raise 2-3 points (from 92 to 92.3).
MTBE is oxygenated (lower BTU but makes gas burn better).
Methanol (wood alcohol) or Ethanol (grain alcohol) is found in Gasohol but is mildly corrosive.
And besides the octane boost ingredients above, mineral spirits (for cleaning)
and transmission fluid (for lubricating) were added.
AHHHHHH, the cycle of LIFE!
-Larry
DanenGraham
Big in the rear
Re: AV gas pros and cons
I have used 100LL before on my truck, never took any logs but the plugs didnt have any black specks on them. I have read that AV fuel uses a different octane rating scale and can be different that what you would think as well. Cant remember if its lower or higher though.
I have used 100LL before on my truck, never took any logs but the plugs didnt have any black specks on them. I have read that AV fuel uses a different octane rating scale and can be different that what you would think as well. Cant remember if its lower or higher though.
tytom
Donating Member
Re: AV gas pros and cons
100LL blue gas is great. Works good in pretty much anything. Used to run it in turbo cars too, worked great...nowdays we just run E85 in blown/turbo motors, but still run the blue stuff in nitrous motors. The stuff is good enough to spray a 42 jet in the fogger on a 13:1 BBC. O2 sensors last about 2 seasons in Avgas motors. AVGAS rocks.
100LL blue gas is great. Works good in pretty much anything. Used to run it in turbo cars too, worked great...nowdays we just run E85 in blown/turbo motors, but still run the blue stuff in nitrous motors. The stuff is good enough to spray a 42 jet in the fogger on a 13:1 BBC. O2 sensors last about 2 seasons in Avgas motors. AVGAS rocks.
liquidswords88
I pity da fool
Re: AV gas pros and cons
Syclone3, quite a post there. You speak of fuel as if everybody that's drives a car with a combustion engine needs to prevent detonation. The majority of people who would choose to run aviation fuel are not dedicated racers. If they were they would be ordering 55 gallon drums of proper race fuel of their choice. I have been racing circle track cars for 15 years and have never once ran av gas in any single one of my cars. The people running av gas are weekend warrior looking for an edge. The damage caused to cats and sensors is the cost of racing to a true racer. To a daily driver it in my opinion is not worth the gain. Everybody is entitled to their opinion, but the fact is for every 1 true race car there is 25 others who would like to think they are. To them I say order some unleaded race fuel.
Syclone3, quite a post there. You speak of fuel as if everybody that's drives a car with a combustion engine needs to prevent detonation. The majority of people who would choose to run aviation fuel are not dedicated racers. If they were they would be ordering 55 gallon drums of proper race fuel of their choice. I have been racing circle track cars for 15 years and have never once ran av gas in any single one of my cars. The people running av gas are weekend warrior looking for an edge. The damage caused to cats and sensors is the cost of racing to a true racer. To a daily driver it in my opinion is not worth the gain. Everybody is entitled to their opinion, but the fact is for every 1 true race car there is 25 others who would like to think they are. To them I say order some unleaded race fuel.
Re: AV gas pros and cons
Out of curiosity what is the big deal with Torco, specifically? Is it not just another MMT additive when thrown in the gas tank with 20 gallons?
I know everyone on car forums bashes octane boosters, but the SDS sheets for Torco look no different than most actual octane boosting additives with MMT. It's no surprise that you get higher octane when adding it by the 32oz can to a half or a quarter tank though, is it?
Based on SDS numbers,
Torco has .1-10% MMT
NOS Octane Booster has 5-10% and an arguably better blend of other crap
Turbo 108 Racing fuel concentrate is 3-5%
Lucas Octane Booster is 1-5%
Royal Purple is <2%
Without knowing actual breakdowns, NOS advertises 30-60 points/12oz bottle for 16 gal and seems to be the highest concentration, but also pricy at $8-15/ bottle.
Torco is $20 for 32oz
Lucas can be had as a 12 pack of 15oz for $80 on amazon and looks like the best bang for the buck.
They all price out fairly close per ounce if you shop around though
Out of curiosity what is the big deal with Torco, specifically? Is it not just another MMT additive when thrown in the gas tank with 20 gallons?
I know everyone on car forums bashes octane boosters, but the SDS sheets for Torco look no different than most actual octane boosting additives with MMT. It's no surprise that you get higher octane when adding it by the 32oz can to a half or a quarter tank though, is it?
Based on SDS numbers,
Torco has .1-10% MMT
NOS Octane Booster has 5-10% and an arguably better blend of other crap
Turbo 108 Racing fuel concentrate is 3-5%
Lucas Octane Booster is 1-5%
Royal Purple is <2%
Without knowing actual breakdowns, NOS advertises 30-60 points/12oz bottle for 16 gal and seems to be the highest concentration, but also pricy at $8-15/ bottle.
Torco is $20 for 32oz
Lucas can be had as a 12 pack of 15oz for $80 on amazon and looks like the best bang for the buck.
They all price out fairly close per ounce if you shop around though