What converter to use?
- Thread starter 1quikAWD
- Start date
TurboManiacal
Donating Member
John,
You have a wonderful opportunity here...al is right you need to decide if you are staying stock or if you want to go bigger. If you're going bigger then you might as well get a PT&E kit. If you're getting one of those, then I'd go with a TCS (pricey) converter from Brian Hartmann. People have lamented the high price but I know of noone that has lamented the performance.
You have a wonderful opportunity here...al is right you need to decide if you are staying stock or if you want to go bigger. If you're going bigger then you might as well get a PT&E kit. If you're getting one of those, then I'd go with a TCS (pricey) converter from Brian Hartmann. People have lamented the high price but I know of noone that has lamented the performance.
Kinda giving some goofy advice here IMO.
You should really gauge a stall based on the motor, its powerband, and your goals. Do you want drivability & a tight converter, or would you rather have something racier and looser?
Also, many people will argue the performance of a loose 9-11 converter. I hate any of 'em that are loose, and *many* people received loose ones.
IMO, this is what I'd do
stock motor, or mild motor, say .430 lift cam/mild heads - tighter 12" body converter 2800ish stall
built motor - ~.500" cam, ported L35/ Vortec or larger heads - then I'd consider a small body converter.
I've had several flavors of both kinds, and heard first hand issues with both kinds.
You have to select components with a goal in mind, don't build around a turbo, or a cam, or a converter.
With your buildup, First I'd ask - what are your goals? What turbos have you been looking at? Are you planning on 50# injectors?
Let's go from there....
You should really gauge a stall based on the motor, its powerband, and your goals. Do you want drivability & a tight converter, or would you rather have something racier and looser?
Also, many people will argue the performance of a loose 9-11 converter. I hate any of 'em that are loose, and *many* people received loose ones.
IMO, this is what I'd do
stock motor, or mild motor, say .430 lift cam/mild heads - tighter 12" body converter 2800ish stall
built motor - ~.500" cam, ported L35/ Vortec or larger heads - then I'd consider a small body converter.
I've had several flavors of both kinds, and heard first hand issues with both kinds.
You have to select components with a goal in mind, don't build around a turbo, or a cam, or a converter.
With your buildup, First I'd ask - what are your goals? What turbos have you been looking at? Are you planning on 50# injectors?
Let's go from there....
You don't select a converter based on turbo.
You should build a motor with a turbo that fits it, and a converter that matches it.
With the turbo reasoning, you could select a 72 series turbo for his truck, and get a 3200 stall to match that turbo... and you'd probably have a dog, as nothing would match.
You should build a motor with a turbo that fits it, and a converter that matches it.
With the turbo reasoning, you could select a 72 series turbo for his truck, and get a 3200 stall to match that turbo... and you'd probably have a dog, as nothing would match.
The motor will have the .412 Cam, I have a set if L35's that are ported, polished w/a 3 angle valve job. still not sure on the turbo(suggestions are welcome), 3" exhaust, and most likely the Ultimate 50. It will be a daily driver so I want some driveability, but will also see some track time.
Thanks,
John
Thanks,
John
BigAl...
Member
Alllllright lets get this flame party started :drinking: he mentioned "Mild performance rebuild(cam, p&p heads, 3"exhaust, upgraded turbo(hopefully)and Ultimate)" it seems he has selected his cam and heads, and from his tone it doesn't seem like he has selected a .700 cam or 18* heads w/2.10 valves. Until he says otherwise I'll assume he's gone for something in the neighborhood of the tried and trusted comp412 and probably some l35's or some vortecs either way the power band is gonna be in the same ballpark. as you mentioned you can't put a 72 turbo on a stock engine (I agree) but we're not talking about a stock engine! and it seems he's thinking of the minimum required to run anything from a PTE 51 to an T72(I seem to remember a certain truck with the comp412 stock vortecs and a t72 that ran pretty well last July). Please, this is not intended as a pissing match, just some good conversation between two fellow syty'rs
BigAl...
BigAl...
Yep, you are right.
i want specifics.
A truck running cleaned up vortecs, with a 412 cam & 1.6 rockers, ported exhaust manifolds, and an air-air
VERSUS (what he could be referring to)
a truck that is heavier, with a .430" lift cam, L35's, stock exhaust manifolds...
I wouldn't recommend a 72 for the latter. I wouldn't really recommend a 72 for the first one - unless you knew what you were doing. Tony and Nolan know what they are doing. I won't recommend anyone run a 72 on any of my chips - 50# won't support a 72's capability, a 63 is more than enough to run out of injector with the 50s. So judging by the goals, turbo, engine specifics, you can help to decide on a stall converter. If he told us that this truck was his daily driver and he was worried about mileage, I'd throw the 9-11 types out the window.
I have had good results with some combinations, and horrible results with some combinations. I just want to know the whole picture before someone says to use a 9-11 on a mild buildup - I just don't see consistency between those converters, and some trucks just *don't* need that kind of stall converter. I see no reason to run bigger than a 51 turbo on a stock motor. I see no reason to run a small body converter if you aren't shooting for faster than 11.7 or so. I see no reason to run a 72 unless you want 10s.
i want specifics.
A truck running cleaned up vortecs, with a 412 cam & 1.6 rockers, ported exhaust manifolds, and an air-air
VERSUS (what he could be referring to)
a truck that is heavier, with a .430" lift cam, L35's, stock exhaust manifolds...
I wouldn't recommend a 72 for the latter. I wouldn't really recommend a 72 for the first one - unless you knew what you were doing. Tony and Nolan know what they are doing. I won't recommend anyone run a 72 on any of my chips - 50# won't support a 72's capability, a 63 is more than enough to run out of injector with the 50s. So judging by the goals, turbo, engine specifics, you can help to decide on a stall converter. If he told us that this truck was his daily driver and he was worried about mileage, I'd throw the 9-11 types out the window.
I have had good results with some combinations, and horrible results with some combinations. I just want to know the whole picture before someone says to use a 9-11 on a mild buildup - I just don't see consistency between those converters, and some trucks just *don't* need that kind of stall converter. I see no reason to run bigger than a 51 turbo on a stock motor. I see no reason to run a small body converter if you aren't shooting for faster than 11.7 or so. I see no reason to run a 72 unless you want 10s.
Captain Morgan
Moderated User
I'll sell my 9/11 for $575. It only has a few miles on it. 
smeagol said:
Mileage is not really a concern, I have 2 other vehicles for that, I just dont want to launch at every light. Before all is said and done, I will end up at least port matching the exhaust manifolds and probally a custom crossover. As we speak, my brother is looking for air-to-air ic's. The L35's are ported and polished, 3 angle walve job an 1.6 roller tip rockers( heads were completely rebuilt in Oct). I would love to see mid to low 12's. I know that the truck is heavier,(truck weighs 4400lbs w/ me in it) but the gears (hopefully) will make up for it(3.73 w/ smaller tires=4.21 gear ratio).
I said the truck will be my daily driver, but not by necessity, I do have other vehicles. I want to terrorize unsuspecting Maros and Stangs, along w/ the occasional stock Ty.
John
1quikAWD said:
Well, judging on those goals, I'd say something larger than a 20g is in order; PTE, custom setup from Mike Lee, or hybrid even. Also, with your 3.73 gearing, I'd rather see you have a tight converter in there. 3.42's are really ideal for the trucks, as the gearing loads the motor more. With a loose converter & 3.73's, you'd shift into 2nd, or almost over-rev, right off the line. We used a tighter converer in the Braphoon - it had 3.42's, ported L35's, mild cam (.430" I believe), stock exhaust manifolds & stock IC. With that combination, response was great, no need to give it extra gas to just idle around town. What cam are you going with ? What boost levels are you going to run ?
Your buildup is quite different than any other syty around for 2 big reasons - 1 - the weight and - 2 - the gearing. Those will definitely affect your decision.
Keep in mind the confusing nomenclature we use around here...
the 412 refers to the Comp Cams 412 camshaft - which is .500" lift & 205 duration (I believe), the .430 lift cam is usually people referring to the ATR / Crane cam, which is a mild .430" lift and like 194-200 duration.
You may want to talk to some people on the board running similar combinations. Erue is doing his own chipping with a cam similar to the 412 grind. Copying a proven combo isn't exactly ground breaking stuff, but it makes it much easier for people to share experiences, as well as calibrations. Might also chat with those same people about their converter choices.
the 412 refers to the Comp Cams 412 camshaft - which is .500" lift & 205 duration (I believe), the .430 lift cam is usually people referring to the ATR / Crane cam, which is a mild .430" lift and like 194-200 duration.
You may want to talk to some people on the board running similar combinations. Erue is doing his own chipping with a cam similar to the 412 grind. Copying a proven combo isn't exactly ground breaking stuff, but it makes it much easier for people to share experiences, as well as calibrations. Might also chat with those same people about their converter choices.