Syclone in surgery

[RUSTYNAIL]

Re: Syclone in surgery

The 4L60E has not been a viable option for the Sy-Ty community because of several factors. The transmission case that makes it a true bolt in was only used less than 5 years and of those years only two were the correct electronics for the TCI software to control properly. The leading shops that have put forth the effort to make a 4L60E survive lets face it have been focused in the LS communty which has been a booming market. I have built several 4L60E's for McCoy and even the Vengence Racing truck even though it was a LS conversion but retained the SyTy T-case and AWD. It's not the cheapest option making a 4L60E survive with the upgraded parts needed but it is the option I chose for my truck as well. :tup:

 

[cloneman315]

Re: Syclone in surgery

How does the controller setup work?

 

[RUSTYNAIL]

Re: Syclone in surgery

How does the controller setup work?

The controller we use is the TCI Transmission controller. TCI also makes a harness that is universal and will work, we custom build our own harnesses in house to better fit the application. The controller will recieve its inputs via CAN if you are using a XFI unit or you will need to tap into the current wiring. You will need to attach to the TPS sensor, find an RPM signal,MAP sensor if you choose,and vechicle speed sensor. The controller comes with softwrae and the wizard will walk you through the initial set-up easily. I also would be happy to build a file for anyone like I did for John Gerbers Typhoon to help with some tuning tricks I have learned. Changes to the file are quite simple and you even have the ability to run two seperate transmission tunes with just the flick of a switch.

 

[cloneman315]

Re: Syclone in surgery

sounds nice

 

[WyoSyclone]

Re: Syclone in surgery

sounds nice

x2

 

[Maxtor]

Re: Syclone in surgery

Mr. Gerber has told me many nice things about RPM as well.... seems like a shop that has its act together with both building transmissions and customer service. Looking forward to getting up and meeting the crew. Wish I could have made the Muncie track day!

As a side note, my 700r4 just passed 7 years in my truck making mid-low 10 sec passes the whole time and shifts just as strong as day one. Part throttle shifts have never been harsh, but WOT shifts are just as crisp as always. Not a lot of miles but plenty of "spirited" driving. No idea what WHP I make but enough to push a full weight truck low 10's.

 

[T-Bone]

Re: Syclone in surgery

Mr. Gerber has told me many nice things about RPM as well.... seems like a shop that has its act together with both building transmissions and customer service. Looking forward to getting up and meeting the crew. Wish I could have made the Muncie track day!

As a side note, my 700r4 just passed 7 years in my truck making mid-low 10 sec passes the whole time and shifts just as strong as day one. Part throttle shifts have never been harsh, but WOT shifts are just as crisp as always. Not a lot of miles but plenty of "spirited" driving. No idea what WHP I make but enough to push a full weight truck low 10's.

Ditto your input. Always have heard inpressive reports regarding your Sy as well.

 

[BigBadSmoosh]

Re: Syclone in surgery

I think this rustynail guy might have some insight.

I agree, i am hopeful that there is an alternative to a 4l80e..

hopefully their transmissions last and are reliable, it would be interesting to find out what kind of magical components are inside to make it last

i'm just playing devil's advocate here, if JSM says RPM knows their stuff, than obviously they do. :tup:

 

[BigBadSmoosh]

Re: Syclone in surgery

i'm also not one to make large amounts of horsepower, so i don't plan on blowing up a stock 700r4.. i make sure my cable is adjusted properly and the fluid is clean as that is really all i can do to keep my trans running.

knowing that there is another shop that builds solid 700r4s is good, however not all of us want to run 10s and spend $3000+ on a trans, hopefully there are also lower cost options available.

 

[RUSTYNAIL]

Re: Syclone in surgery

Some good stuff in this thread. I can't stay away any longer. I've wondered why no one has tried the M30 yet. Electronic controls are so much easier to set up. And RPM's position that electronically-controlled line pressure makes for a longer-lived unit makes sense. I've never thought of that.

In his quote above I highlighted "blocked accumulators". This dumb practise just won't die, and has been going on since the TH350 debued in 1969. All it does is break parts. Mostly sprags and bands. Hi line pressure does the same thing. Breaks parts.

One question for RPM: You mention you consider "only two years have the electronics that work with the TCI controller". I assume you mean the 93 &94 non-PWM M30s. 95-up have PWM, and to make it worse there are "blue-blue" and "blue-grey" 95-only PWMs. I'm not going to dig through my stuff, because I know you know this, but Trans-Go has a kit that eliminates the PWM, and the P1870 codes that cause high-line default, and the broken sun shell and rear planet that comes after the customer ignores the harsh-shifting.

Why can't (or won't) you use the 95-up with the PWM defeated? (If you prefer to use the 93-94 only). I have a 95 blue-grey M30 that I'm going to put in something. I would like to use the TCI controller. The PWM thing will have to be addressed. Hence the question.

Fascinating thread. Kudos to T-Bone for trying something different. I think it will work out well. Good Luck.

Dave

Dave, We actually use the 96-97 PWM stuff and eliminate the PWM in the valvebody. The 93-94 and 95 electronics are different. Thats the short version with out going into great detail.:tup: The issue with the 95 unit would be the 3-2 control solenoid and I'm not sure how a T-com box would work with that solenoid.

 

[cloneman315]

Re: Syclone in surgery

can you use your tc out of the standard 700?Lockup or non lockup

 

[RUSTYNAIL]

Re: Syclone in surgery

can you use your tc out of the standard 700?Lockup or non lockup

Yes, The converters will interchange. I would not recommend a non-lock up converter though. I know it has been done for years and I'm guilty myself back in my turbo Buick days, but the lock-up technology has come a long way. The lock-up should be retained to reduce heat build-up when in cruise state not to mention it should increase fuel milage slightly.

 

[2kwik4u]

Re: Syclone in surgery

Well, the 80E through them would have set me back about $5700-6000 since it requires different bracing, output shaft, driveshaft (I think, but don't quote me on that one).....there was a number of things increasing the price. They have video's and documentation of their 60E builds in 1,000 RWHP cars (mainly vettes) that make consistent passes w/o issue. I am guessing the Syclone I have there with a fine tune will put out 600-650 WHP so my thought was that a top of the line 60E will suffice at a savings of $1900 over the 80E, without a flaw in performance. RPM stands by their builds so if I frag the 60E within 2 years without exceeding 1000 WHP (they can deduce HP by damage), I can get a full credit towards a 80E. They assured me I won't be back with this truck for a rebuild using their level 6 package though. One really has to go see their products and gain a respect for their experience. They didn't start up their business this spring.....race teams across the country contract with them for tranny builds. That speaks volumes.....

I wasn't intending to imply they wouldn't hold up, just that they really hadn't been tested publicly in this platform. We all know these trucks have significantly higher amounts of traction and torque than your typical street/strip vehicles. Which in turn leads to early transmission failures for a lot of us. I'm really curious to see how they work out.

Switching gears; are you and Jeremy coming to the Shindig? Hoping so. I am taking my X-cross ace in the hole and need someone to hand Harmon cleanex's and console him while I am on the course . If I can't conquer him in the Lap 1 Ty, it will definately be attributed to driver headspace and timing. If that happens, can I toss you the keys and see what the truck is really capable of?

Current thoughts are no, we won't be there. Timing isn't working out great for any of us, but we've pulled off bigger trips with less prep. Most likely we won't know until the week before (like next week ).

 

[eviltwin]

Re: Syclone in surgery

That quote is tripping over deals that could take months to reach fruition. The DIY common base price for a quality 4L80E total conversion is $4500. Show me a low mileage "warrantied" 4L80E anywhere for $500....I'd rather have a professional built 60E with 0 miles, a warranty and quality install over a junkyard special that could last a couple runs. To each his own though. My money is on RPM all the way.

Smart move on letting them do it. $350 is a favor to us IMO for a tranny R/R and we don't have to worry about missing a component or possible under/over torque on the reinstall. They are very good at what they do and their work enviroment is clean. That really impressed me!

i could do a 4l80e swap for around $2100 any day of the week. the install time would all depend on how lond it took the shaft/adapter/convertor to get to me. have done it twice already. yes it will take longer but not that long.

 

[cloneman315]

Re: Syclone in surgery

So just locking the converter for cruising correct?Isnt locking it under full load harder on it?

 

[Beavis]

Re: Syclone in surgery

So just locking the converter for cruising correct?Isn't locking it under full load harder on it?

Yes, locking it under wot is hard on it. Some manufacturers don't want you to do it cause the lock up wasn't meant for it. Others say lock it all you want, wot and/or cruise. That was a big factor for me when I bought mine for the 80e swap and am not regretting it. :2cents:

 

[cloneman315]

Re: Syclone in surgery

Mine runs a hell of alot faster with it unlocked.

 

[cloneman315]

Re: Syclone in surgery

Shaun you might have it wrapped up,I dont think I am going to be auto x ing.Just dont feel like messing with my suspension.Got some parts coming 13 gallon tank and carbon shaft and aluminum drums for 1/8 mile fun.

 

[T-Bone]

Re: Syclone in surgery

Shaun you might have it wrapped up,I dont think I am going to be auto x ing.Just dont feel like messing with my suspension.Got some parts coming 13 gallon tank and carbon shaft and aluminum drums for 1/8 mile fun.

Well, I don't know....it ain't over till the fat lady sings!! I am confident the CannonBall Lap 1 Ty is gonna make a believer out of a bunch of folks, especially since Jimmy said he wouldn't touch it with a 10 foot pole attached to a 10 foot pole when it was for sale. To be quite honest, it has turned out to be the BEST $5930 I ever parted with. Win or lose, I am looking forward to having some great fun.

Hoping to make a couple passes down the track Friday night and see what this thing will churn out. I will go on record and say a 6.7x which should make me a Big Gun, like you .

My younger brother is coming down as well driving his modded 03 Cobra or 07 Z06. Invited him to line up against the Ty but he chickened out.

 

[cloneman315]

Re: Syclone in surgery

yeah lol have done some changes so might go back the wrong way